UPDATE: Let's continue exploring the concept of a physical III Community.I think many of us agree that Wyoming has many advantages, not the least of which is the fact that it is already one of the most Liberty-minded states in the republic.
Let's also continue our theory of importing our own industry so that we can continue to interact with the rest of the country from the safety of our own community, earn a real living in a business we enjoy - we open a firearms manufacturing company.
Now, look at the county map of Wyoming above. Essentially, as offered by several great folks who have firsthand knowledge of the state, we have mountains in the west and high plains desert in the east. Eastern land is cheaper as a result.
Where would you choose to settle a III town, if we were to pioneer the effort? Personally, I'd choose the western part of the state with mountains at our backs, that comes with the big game many of us like to eat. Farming meat is already an industry in the state. The only thing missing for me is access to serious salt water.
Now let your mind consider the power to negotiate an incoming, job-producing industry has when choosing where to settle and set up shop. A group of business owners intending to open a hypothetical firearm factory would have bargaining power with city, county, and to some small extent, even state politicians. Tax breaks, favorable terms for infrastucture development, carving out the boundaries of a new town...the potential is significant.
Consider selecting a county and sitting down with the existing county Fathers, and negotiating a new town, with state/county recognized autonomy...
Once the factory is up and running, electing proper county-level officials gets easy, as J. Croft suggested.
If there are a few small towns already in the area, even better. Who wants to start from scratch? We'd have all the benefits of actually starting from scratch, without having to actually rough it quite that much.
Do you see the potential?
Is this not the concept advanced by the secessionists amongst us, a defacto separation, self-sufficiency with the ability to engage in commerce and self-governance under the Natural Laws recognized in the DoI, Constitution and BoR?
Is this not as close as any of us will ever come to self-determination...while building the ability to defend ourselves if it ever becomes necessary?
We are not re-inventing the wheel. Mining towns have operated on this model for centuries. If the primary local industry is employee-owned (rather than by those evil Robber-Barons), is it not what our most Liberty-minded Founders had in mind?
Isn't it what you have in mind when you think of how things should be?
Kerodin
III
~~
This comment from J. Croft deserves a thread. It is from the III Brand post below.
J. Croft Mar 6, 2012 11:08 AM
What's needed isn't a logo, it's action.
If it's shooting then get away with it.
I propose making a III open carry safe zone.
How?
Picking a town with a corrupt, incompetent government and run a full campaign ticket of candidates, constantly pounding on the enemy's faults and once elected, FIRE EVERYONE and hire Patriots. Scrap most or all the local ordnances, encourage entreprenurialism, get the funds listed in that town's Consolidated Annual Financial Report-not the budget-and give back to the community that twon's shysters looted from.
Broadcast the results and you'll have a peaceable Second American Revolution. And a brand for the Three Percenters.
~~
What J. Croft is proposing is essentially a FreeState Project on a small town/village/County level, correct?
This is a concept I have considered for a long time, but I could never get around the issue of revenue - how do we feed ourselves without going agrarian.
Consider: A state like Wyoming that is already Liberty-friendly. Find a county that has a low population, so it would not take a mass migration to move into the area and elect a III Sheriff, and then III Patriots to other essential offices.
Here's how we feed ourselves and make a statement: What if we started a firearms company? Wyoming passed the Firearms Freedom Act, which included the power to arrest any Fed who pushed. A III Sheriff, supported by a III community would almost ensure a Constitutional Crisis if the Feds pushed...
Starting a firearm manufacturing company is something that Mrs. Kerodin has researched in-depth. The paperwork side is annoying. The insurance isn't the cheapest. But the skills needed, especially with modern CNC equipment, make turning out high quality firearms with a (relatively) low investment possible.
Patriots who move into the county could work at the company - I don't think there are too many who visit III blogs who would have a problem being part of such a business. The earning potential, especially if employee-owned, would be open-ended. Such an endeavor could, literally, give even 40-somethings & older folks the chance to change careers, if you've been locked into a trade/profession you'd rather abandon.
Housing: If the company owned a piece of property, why could it not drag in cheap trailers for initial housing? Or, build a dorm-style building for starters? As the company grows, incomes grow, and people can build what they want, where they want.
Community: Could not the company build a small "Town Hall" or other community buildings? We have III folks who would probably love to farm - what if we had a few III folks who chose to grow food rather than work in the gun company? All sorts of support businesses would pop up, from restaurants to whatever...
Capital: There's the hardest part, of course. But it is not insurmountable. It won't happen by selling flags & mugs, but it can be done.
Is such a concept not the classic "Build it and they will come" scenario?
If you, the average III Patriot, knew you had a job and place to sleep, and the potential to evolve your position into a real income, in a community filled with people who shared your values - would you go? Consider having the ability to truly influence the curriculum in your kid's school.
Yes, I know I am flying at the outer edges of the envelope right now. But would not this concept even appeal to the secessionists?
Weigh in, please. J. Croft, thank you.
And folks, while such a concept is BIG THINK...it is not impossible. We are Americans. If we choose to do something, we can get it done.
Is this something worth considering?
Kerodin
III
I just posted a comment on FreeNorthCarolina asking if anyone knew of a place I could move to that actually allowed for the liberties that the country was founded upon. This is something I would be very interested in. There are a ton of logistics that would need to be taken into account but if I do recall there is at least one town in Wyoming with a population of 1. Can't get much less populated than that.
ReplyDeleteNot intending to torpedo anything, but keep in mind the market for your product produced and sold relating to the WY FFA would have a somewhat limited market based on the same small population of that state that started things off.
ReplyDeleteOn the flip side of that, this process could be repeated multiple times over in different states across the country. Just like Mickey-Dees, but without the runs.
I'm retired, but if it were to happen in Wyoming, I'd seriously consider going back to work, or assisting in whatever way I could. My wife and I own our own fifth-wheel which we live in full-time, so we could be mobile, although we hope to find property to lease so we can finish our preps.
ReplyDeleteI know it's a reach, but if this were to materialize, I could easily see myself a part of it.
This is a really big question and as I have been dealing with a flareup of carpal tunnel for a week now I can't say all I have in mind on this but here are a few items.
ReplyDeleteIt's not fundamentally different from Covington's Northwest Front, specifically their method of attracting people and fitting in to the locality. This is not to state or imply anything about differences or similarities in ideological goals (Covington's hero is Hitler) - point is, same basic problem and similar proposed solution and similar secondary problems in implementing it.
One problem, belling the cat. Who sets up in the chosen place first and starts putting effort into organizing things locally, with no guarantee or sign that others will follow. This remains a problem for a number of further arrivals, until the number is large enough that it actually is a community and not a few malcontented individuals following a dream. I don't think any of these sorts of schemes have gotten past the 'atomized individuals' stage yet.
Cost of entry. Selling home, moving, finding work, etc. Just the disruption of uprooting a life and moving (especially with a family) is a big one. Need evidence it's worthwhile. Depending on the local ground organization, the cost of settling in at arrival point can be lowered (good job info, social network, etc - plug newcomers right in), but cost of leaving former life, not. People who live near aged P's - who wants to leave them? Especially in coming bad times.
In general I think the regional differentiation isn't strong enough yet to make something like this reach critical mass. But proving me wrong would be cool.
Ben: There is no reason the gun company could not abide ATF FFL rules and export from Wyoming to the national market - and I suspect a LOT of gun buyers would support such a company.
ReplyDeleteK
severs28
ReplyDeleteThanks and I replied.
=========
A Southerner tried this partially a few years ago, but couldn't get enough interest to sell all the lots. We shall see.
Hell yes it's worth pursuing! Have mechanical, electrical, and building skills, will travel!
ReplyDeleteIt was done in South Africa back in the early '90s
ReplyDeletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orania,_Northern_Cape
From Wikipedia.
"In December 1990, about 40 Afrikaner families, headed by Carel Boshoff, the son-in-law of former South African prime minister Hendrik Verwoerd, bought the dilapidated town, which was a construction camp of builders of the Vanderkloof Dam on Gariep River for around US$ 200,000.[3] This was a few months after the repeal of apartheid laws and the release of Nelson Mandela from prison. The town is privately owned by the Vluytjeskraal Aandeleblok company. "
If a small band of hard core Afrikaners could do it, a group of committed Patriots can achieve something on an ever bigger scale.
an ex South African Afrikaner
Look at Robinson Arms....Alex makes a fine product but many have not heard of RA. RA has been around for years. Firearms manufacturing is not an easy venture.
ReplyDeleteDAN III
Pennsylvania
Everyone moving to one location will maybe work for a while in that one location. But the national PTB would be able to isolate you.
ReplyDeleteThe wife and I have just bought our last place to move to, in our home state. I'd much rather see like minded people in all 50 states reach out to local people of stable, honorable, intelligent mindsets to work, coordinate and change their local areas. Having a national linkup many things can be tried and refined to eventually create a large enough movement to effect real change.
Right now the advantage I see to the concept is that FreeFor does not have a "Hard Knot" of people, anywhere.
ReplyDeleteWould not a county with a few hundred serious III Patriots, in a strong Liberty-minded state, employed in arms manufacturing (a decidedly useful asset when things get rowdy) be a good start?
As for the viability of a new firearms company: I am not sure there has ever been a better time to start such a venture. Of course, the product line would have to be diversified, rather than simply trying to swim in the tactical pool. Marketing would be a breeze and failure would be impossible as long as the product quality is there.
And back to the primary point - a few hundred III families living around an arms factory (with complementary ammo loading division) with their backs to the mountains in a state that can be defended...I don't see a down side.
Kerodin
III
Again, I see nothing but good in this idea. I'm onboard, even though I despise cold and snow. Let's do it.
ReplyDeleteTake a look at the Flathead Valley of Montana. It's not exactly the start from scratch "Galt's Gulch" you describe as the total county population is around 90,000, but that amounts to only 15 people per square mile.
ReplyDeletePeople are already moving there. Pastor Chuck Baldwin (http://chuckbaldwinlive.com/home/?p=3662), Stewart Rhodes of Oath Keepers, and Brandon Smith of Alt-Market just to name a few prominent names.
Montana also has a firearms freedom act (the first if I remember correctly) although it lacks the teeth that Wyoming's has.
Just some food for thought.
I love Western Montana. My wife and I spent a year and a half living in Hamilton, MT before deciding to give WY a try. The people are nice in MT, the countryside in that area is much prettier than most of WY, and the weather in the Bitterroot and Flathead Valleys is as good or a little better.
DeleteUnfortunately, Montana is run by its liberals, not the conservative folk who live outside of the big towns (much like beautiful Oregon, where we "fled" from). Look at the two senators they keep electing: Baucus and Tester. Both Democrats, both liberal, both supported Obamacare, Patriot, NDAA, etc.
When I worked for the California Highway Patrol in Northern CA, many of the TOs ("Traffic Officers") who worked at the Yreka facility with me talked about retiring to Hamilton, because of its beauty, great rivers, hunting, etc. I discovered that indeed, there are many, many retired LEOs in the Hamilton area, along with a lot of other California retirees. So, even in many of the smaller towns such as Hamilton, the liberal element has too much to say about how things are run.
I don't know how many Californians are in the Flathead, but given that many Hollywood types own property up there (Ted Turner may have a ranch up there, IIRC), I think that area is run by liberals, too. I'm sure Baldwin and Rhodes will do what they can, but they have an uphill battle ahead of them.
This is a good idea, but my recent move has rendered doing any such thing on my part quite impossible.
ReplyDeleteI can weld, though, and would be interested in something like this in the future.
AP
Sounds Utopian at first blush. Practically, a group of retirees with pensions or at least some steady income and fluid assets to get started would be ideal - at least for a base. One massive financier would be ideal. Im reminded of our our forefathers who migrated with little more than the few items they carried in a wagon, and they had Indians wanting their scalps!
ReplyDeleteWY sounds like a good location, save the weather. Not very practical for the agrarian aspect.
I think it's an interesting possibility. Ultimate Tribe. ;^)
ReplyDeleteThe Patriots in the same geographical area could also support this community from where they are already situated without the moving upheaval until they could move, or perhaps just be a supporting (and radiating ) spoke of the wheel, so to speak. I think it's an idea worth exploring.
Miss Violet
P.S. I think the word is getting out, I just read in the St Maries, Idaho Gazette that one of the men running for sheriff is doing so as a "Constitutional Sheriff", and states if he is elected his dept. and deputies will also have to abide by the Constitution.
Sounds like a great plan, most of us here probably put our own guns together now, I do. I'm not a cnc guy, but I certainly know machines, many ppl here probably know machines. I polished for twenty years. This really sounds like a plan, I definitely hate Cleveland.
ReplyDeleteI see a flaw here. The ATF could shut the whole thing down with nothing more than a few imaginary paperwork errors.
ReplyDeleteKeith,
DeleteThat's when the Firearms Freedom Act would get its real application. A Sheriff who won't allow the Feds to come in and shut down the business would be necessary, and it would go from there. Yes, that would be "David vs Goliath", but it has to happen somewhere, doesn't it?
My father just sent this via email:
ReplyDelete"So now you know which county to move to. Warren County (Strasburg and Front Royal) had the highest % vote for Ron Paul in the state, 59%."
Not a bad start, honestly. And I'm biased, I live in VA.
Rollory: Our America527 ad should be in both Front Royal & Strasburg. But I have no real idea how many people in the area tune into Alex Jones on the afternoon drive home.
DeleteI love Virginia, but like most other places, the Left have more than their share of power.
K
Keith: No plan is without risks, but...
ReplyDelete...Mrs. Kerodin qualifies for an FFL, as do many other people. As with most trade licenses, you simply need a licensee on staff to make the company golden. So, we have every employee apply for their FFL so if one gets burned, there are options.
Additionally, while cash will not solve all of life's problems, it sure can make many go away. There are already FFL holders in Wyoming who could be hired, and there are plenty of FFL holders across the country who would relocate for the right opportunity.
And, sure, ATF could try to monkeywrench everything...which is why the Wyoming Firearms Freedom Act is better than others...
...and, are we not (we III) looking for a mechanism to beat back FedGov tyranny? If we are not afraid of a physical fight, we should not be thwarted by a potential legal or bureaucratic fight, especially if we set the circumstances wherein local and a State Government could/should have our backs.
The trendline and trajectory across America is easy to see: Gun Control is being beaten back. There will come a time (assuming implosion is delayed) when someone like Alan Gura will make a move to roll back GCA '68 and perhaps even NFA, making FedGov regulatory power on 2A impotent.
That is a battle the III should be able to help from the inside, from an industry footing.
I've been handed my arse in many fights. But, sometimes, you still have to throw...
K
Admittedly that's just among Republican primary voters. Still. Not a bad start.
ReplyDelete(ok, tangent over)
Okay, let's for argument's sake, just start eliminating the counties that we are not interested in.
ReplyDeleteK prefers the western part of the state because he likes the mountains and the wild game. I haven't lived in Teton co., but it is well known that it is rich man's land, having Jackson Hole there. Also, Park co. has Cody, which while it isn't as bad as Jackson, is well on it's way. As far as big game, it's across the entire state K, deer, elk, antelope, rabbit, and I know there is moose on the Big Horns and probably in the mountain part of the western counties. When we lived in Lovell (Big Horn co.,) my husband would get home from work, go to the river bottom, get his deer and be home in half an hour. There is more road kill, than most states have game. Which by the way, you'll need a cow catcher on your rig if you move there, lol.
I've lived in Park, Big Horn, Natrona, Hot Springs, Campbell, and Sheridan counties and would be happy to answer any questions about those places.
Miss V
Thanks to all for the great insights to the state.
ReplyDeleteMiss Violet: I think we'd be best served by avoiding the developed rich man's area of Teton County. Since Park is heading the same direction, we'd just be burdening ourselves with unnecessary baggage, I think.
Where would you suggest? Is Big Horn County a nice area in which to live? What about politics and population? Could we make a difference by moving a few hundred or (ultimately) 1,000 active people into the county? (2010 census says Big Horn has about 11,500 total)
Would you suggest a different county?
Thanks,
K
Okay, so we're eliminating Teton co. and Park co. because they fall into rich man's land, we can do the same with Sheridan co., for the same reasons. Not many people are going to cotton to Natrona co. because it's just too high desert, no trees, mountains, or water. Campbell co. is pretty much the same plus the water there has to be piped in because all the water there is contaminated with gases from the coal veins. Sweetwater co. will give certain desert states a run for their money in the u.g.l.y. department.
ReplyDeleteHot Springs co. might be viable, there is only one town with any real population, the rest of them are pretty sparse, as in don't blink when you drive through them or you'll never know you went through a town. They have the owl mts to the west, a river goes through Thermop through the wind river canyon and south is Boysen dam, it's not much to look at, but it's big enough to boat on.
Big Horn co. was settled in the 1800's with a wagon train of Mormons from Utah. These people built farms and ranches. They developed a canal system from the Shoshone river to water their crops. When we lived there the Mormons controlled everything because they were the majority. The area has been depressed for years, but I understand they are experiencing a bit of a surge with the whole oil/gas boom, nothing like in eastern Wyo and ND though. It's anyone's guess if they would work with us, they might be apprehensive of newcomers, but if we were to be able to show them we were conservative they might welcome us. Lovell did allow a prison to be built out their way just to have jobs. I'm not sure I would want to live by that...
I think we should def consider Lincoln, Freemont, and Sublette co. I've never lived in those places, does anyone out there have any experience there. How about you, RegT, have you and the motor home tootled out in those parts?
I think we need some recon...
Miss V
If anyone is seriously considering this, you might reach out to the folks at Free State Wyoming.
ReplyDeletehttp://freestatewyoming.org/
K.
ReplyDeleteI live in AZ. and I "ain't going nowhere" as I love it here, but I stand 100% behind your concept. When it all eventually comes crashing down, who knows what will transpire, time will tell brother.
GREAT article on knife fighting, was not around to post.
Agree with you completely.
Also, need to pop for some cash that I don't have to support your hard work, don't count me out.
BRIII
The Free State Wyoming folks are out on the east side of the state, around Weston county, I think. They would likely make good allies, at the very least.
DeleteI think this is an outstanding idea and have been wishing there was some way to start an intentional community like this. A few of us who are retired or near retirement could form an advanced team - self sufficient enough to put the initial structure, both physical and political, in place.
There have to be more than a handful of people who would go for this, if it could just be jump started. That is the key, getting a visible nucleus in place for everything else to grow from.
Demand for firearms is at an all time high. This is an idea whose time has come.
This was supposed to be a general response, not a specific reply, but for some reason I wasn't getting that option.
DeleteWhat a great idea. I'd sweep the floors and scrub toilets at the firearm factory and offer my programming and IT skills on the side to get in on that deal.
ReplyDeleteYou can count me in. I have been considering the Cody area for several months now. I'll look you up if you get there first.
ReplyDelete